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2012 Rally Poll

8 years 2 weeks ago #3177 by ipgregory
2012 Rally Poll was created by ipgregory
Just got the email through for the 2012 Rally Poll. Thanks Koly it looks like you have automated it and made it very simple to use.

Question though. My understanding was that we were going to poll the members about where to hold the rally and that Lake Havasu was one of the places being considered? The poll however only has the question:

'1. If the next Arizona Land Rover Rally were to be held at an Arizona location that required a 2-4 hour drive, would you attend the event?'

Lake Havasu is further than 4hrs drive for me coming from Maricopa and that means everybody south of me as well so I don't see this as being a valid question on holding the rally there. So is Lake Havasu now off the agenda?

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 2 weeks ago #3181 by stevenson
Replied by stevenson on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Should everyone have recieved an email or is there somewhere on the site to go for the poll? I didnt receive teh email.

thx
Shaun

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8 years 2 weeks ago #3182 by admin
Replied by admin on topic 2012 Rally Poll

stevenson wrote: Should everyone have recieved an email or is there somewhere on the site to go for the poll? I didnt receive teh email.

thx
Shaun


The e-mail poll went out to members only. You have a private message.

00 G500
N4GWG

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8 years 1 week ago #3184 by LeBlanc
Replied by LeBlanc on topic 2012 Rally Poll
I didn't get a poll email.. <!-- s:dizzy: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_dizzy.png" alt=":dizzy:" title="dizzy" /><!-- s:dizzy: -->

Pierre LeBlanc
'87 RRC
'02 D2
N2FWD

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8 years 1 week ago #3185 by admin
Replied by admin on topic 2012 Rally Poll

LeBlanc wrote: I didn't get a poll email.. <!-- s:dizzy: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_dizzy.png" alt=":dizzy:" title="dizzy" /><!-- s:dizzy: -->


That&#39;s because you&#39;re Canadian.

I'll email you the poll this evening.
<!-- s:lmao: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_lmao.gif" alt=":lmao:" title="lmao" /><!-- s:lmao: -->

00 G500
N4GWG

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8 years 1 week ago #3186 by LeBlanc
Replied by LeBlanc on topic 2012 Rally Poll
thank you...

<!-- s:thumbup: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_1thumb_up.gif" alt=":thumbup:" title="thumbsup" /><!-- s:thumbup: -->

I'm American dammit!

Pierre LeBlanc
'87 RRC
'02 D2
N2FWD

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8 years 1 week ago #3187 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
I got it twice!! <!-- s:headbang: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smiley_headbang.gif" alt=":headbang:" title="headbang" /><!-- s:headbang: -->

Probably because I am (still) a Brit... <!-- s:drivin: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_driving.gif" alt=":drivin:" title="drivin" /><!-- s:drivin: -->

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3188 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
So back to the question...

Based on the way the question was worded in the poll email, I read it that we are asking if members would object to the rally being held somewhere inside the area shown on the attached which is the intersection of a 4hr max drive from base for most members. The area varies on whether you include Prescott and Flag in the mix as we have members there of course. If you add in the handful of members further afield then you end up either holding the rally in a park near downtown Phx or nowhere so I assumed it was just based on the majority of the membership locales.

Since the discussion centered around the proposal to hold the 2012 Rally in the Lake Havasu area and this falls nowhere near the zone then I am asking the Rally Committee if Lake Havasu is now off the table with respect to a possible rally location?

If it is, what are the other options being considered? If it's not then the poll doesn't address the question we presumed it was intended for.

I and a number of others could vote for a 4hr drive and still not be in agreement with the suggestion to hold the Rally in Havasu.

Thanks

Ian

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.
Attachments:

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8 years 1 week ago #3190 by 05LR3AZ
Replied by 05LR3AZ on topic 2012 Rally Poll
I probably live the farthest west in the group (that I'm aware of) and 4 hrs gets me to Palm Springs, almost to Las Vegas 4.5hrs, New Mexico Border (East), almost to Page 4.5hrs(North). From Tucson to Lake Havasu it's 4hrs 45min so just about 5hrs. What does any of that mean? Well, not a whole lot really other than the fact that the poll could have been an hour off. <!-- s:eek2: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_eek2.gif" alt=":eek2:" title="eek" /><!-- s:eek2: -->

I'm sensing objection to Lake Havasu though from your comment Ian. I guess I don't understand objection to a new location for an Arizona Rally that is still within Arizona that opens up the club to an assortment of new trails which is right up the alley of what members (you and I included Ian) in not doing the same trails. If it was 3 hours from your location would it be ok then? Or is it that Lake Havasu area itself is unfavorable in your opinion? Have you gone 4wheeling there? Rather than questioning the poll itself please just say what you think the pro's and con's are for what is assumed to be a potential rally location in Lake Havasu. Is it that you have an alternate location in mind and feel that you haven't had the opportunity to voice that? Are you simply frustrated with the process rather than the location itself?

I know that the club would have Southern Arizona members that would attend. Kelly and James went to Parker for a non-LR event and I'm sure it was quite a drive for them. Tucson was a pretty good drive for me but I attended. We've had alot of out of state AZLRO members show up to our rally before.

05' LR3
01' E-350 7.3L 4x4 - Sportsmobile pop-up
94' DI - ROKROVR
[bt]91' RRC SWB[/b]
Shaun - KF7KOY

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8 years 1 week ago #3191 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Hi Shaun,

I have already stated my position in the other thread so it's no hidden agenda that I am in the dissenting group with respect to hosting the rally in Havasu.

The point of the poll when it was discussed on the other thread was to see what the membership opinion was with respect to the same question. Essentially, should we hold the rally in Havasu or somewhere else. That is not what came out in the poll however.

My point in this thread is that the poll question is not what was discussed and is both vague and misleading when considering the question behind it. In my D90 its 4-1/2 to 5 hrs drive to Lake Havasu from Maricopa where I live. Remember I like many others will not be driving a car up there but an off road biased vehicle loaded down with gear so I won't be driving at full highway speeds. So even though I have responded that I am prepared to travel 2-4 hrs to a Rally location I am not agreeing with hosting the rally in Havasu. Tucson is nearly a 2 hr drive for me depending on the location as are many of the areas north of Phoenix that we run trails in. I am quite happy to do 2+ hrs driving even for just a trail run but Havasu is well beyond that.

2-4hrs is an approximate radius from Phx that includes Havasu but not from Tucson or some of the other locations. Tucson for example is more like a 6+ hr drive to Havasu not including rest stops, breaks for the kids, etc. So a whole day to be fair in either direction. The poll question was if anything biased the other way to try minimize what would be a major trip for many people. Not to mention that you just made the 3 day rally a 5 day for many people.

That's going to deter many of the local AZ folks who we typically only see at the rally or those that are considering this 'off road thing' and are prospective new members because it's too much time to devote to something they are on the fence about. Since the 'AZLRO' Rally is or should be about gathering the 'AZLRO' members together for an annual event and promoting the club locally within the state to attract new members then I don't see holding it on the other very sparsely populated side of the state as a way to drive that.

It was stated in the other thread that the club would poll the members and if the members decided they wanted the rally in Havasu then so be it and we could put the matter to rest. The poll however does not do what was asked for and even if 100% of the members respond in a positive to a 2-4hr drive for the rally you cannot use that as justification to host the rally in Havasu because that specific question was not asked (why not exactly since that was the purpose of the poll in the 1st place?) and many are further away than 4 hrs.

We have people who come from very great distances to attend the rally so just because 1 or 2 may choose to drive to the other side of the state or even from other states and or areas of the US does not mean the general membership is willing to and the rally is or should be about the general membership, not just a handful of people (myself included). Hence the poll or hence what the poll was supposed to be.....

-- Edit --

I went into my interpretation of the pros and cons and why I think the Lake Havasu area is a bad location to select for the rally in quite a bit of detail on the other 'suggestions' thread Shaun as well as stating my position on the choice. The purpose of this thread was not to rehash that but to point out that we had not put forward the question in the poll the way that was discussed. In fact, in my opinion and based off the criteria I have set out above, we never asked the question at all.

I will add that I was a little confused as to why my calculations as to the time to drive different places seemed so out of whack with yours so I called a friend in Tucson who has visited Lake Havasu a number of times. He lives on the north side of Tucson and quite close to I-10. he told me that the fastest he has ever made it there from Tucson is 6:15 but generally it takes 6-1/5 to 7 hours if the roads are clear and he doesn't get caught in Phx too badly or stop along the way other than for gas and a potty break. So if anything consider that I am underestimating the drive times and we're not just talking about an odd hours difference in the poll are we?

Maybe you've got a supercharger hidden under the hood of that LR3 you haven't let us in on yet? <!-- s:thinkin: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smiley_thinkin.gif" alt=":thinkin:" title="thinking" /><!-- s:thinkin: --> <!-- s:eek2: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_eek2.gif" alt=":eek2:" title="eek" /><!-- s:eek2: -->

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3195 by 05LR3AZ
Replied by 05LR3AZ on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Thanks Ian. Yeah I guess the LR3 does move a little faster than the Disco and road delays does play a role in traveling.

05' LR3
01' E-350 7.3L 4x4 - Sportsmobile pop-up
94' DI - ROKROVR
[bt]91' RRC SWB[/b]
Shaun - KF7KOY

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8 years 1 week ago #3198 by ronrwatkins
Replied by ronrwatkins on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Is there time to resend out the poll (as I assume that it will be an agenda topic at our meeting next weekend) with the following 2 revisions/addition?

1. Rephrase the 1st question to indicate specific locations or the ability to suggest an alternate location? And indicate a max travel time / travel radius.

Originally I was thinking distance didn't really matter I had planned on camping or getting a hotel room for the duration, but Ian has a good point about travel time and having to calculate in an extra couple of days just for traveling. I would suspect that those who do not have the work flexibility (or time) would have to leave Sunday vs.Monday - potentially reducing Rally participation on Sunday.

2. Vote on the date preference - I believe that Doug narrowed it down to 2 possible weeks in April based on holidays and other competing events. When is Spring Break - is that a better option for those w/kids? Just asking since we are looking at April this year.

Happy Wednesday! <!-- s:cheerleader: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_cheerLeader.gif" alt=":cheerleader:" title="cheerleader" /><!-- s:cheerleader: -->

Diana
KF7TXG

Owner of Henry (2011 LR4) &amp; Margot (2013 R-Pod 178) <!-- s:ahhh: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_ahhh.gif" alt=":ahhh:" title="ahhh" /><!-- s:ahhh: -->

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8 years 1 week ago #3203 by LeBlanc
Replied by LeBlanc on topic 2012 Rally Poll
One thing that is being lost in the discussion is also the impact to the logistics of putting on an event that is 2-4 hrs drive.

it's easier to gauge the impact to general attendees.. Eg. &quot;would you travel to attend, and be a participant?&quot;

more difficult is: would you travel to help in these areas:

- Trail Leaders (pre-runs, trail prep, maps, communication planning, local ham assistance)
- Volunteers (setup, tear down, transport rally prizes)
- Banquet services selection
- Vendors (will vendors attend vendor night?)
- Sponsors (will they attend?)

Myself, personally would have to really think about a (Flagstaff, Havasu, other) rally location and my commitment level due to family and work. The 2010 rally in Tucson didn't work out for me, even though it was close. It also fell on my daughter's birthday weekend, but I was able to pull it off in phoenix.

Overall, there is less risk of losing Phoenix people as we think west or north, but Tucson people will have much more to think about.

So, would Ian (as an example) drive 2-4 hrs to attend the rally? maybe.. sure..

Would Ian make a commitment to drive several times back and forth to pre-run trails, visit potential banquet sites, transport rally prizes, etc? maybe not..

The burden of managing this will fall on a smaller group for sure. The reason we like Phoenix and Tucson rallies, is because we have members and volunteers who live in those cities and can directly impact it's success. Our local vendors and sponsors included.

Just wanted people to think about it.. I'm all for exploring new areas, but to risk a growing successful rally in the name of exploring a new area... I dunno...

My $0.02

Pierre LeBlanc
'87 RRC
'02 D2
N2FWD

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8 years 1 week ago #3204 by Red October
Replied by Red October on topic 2012 Rally Poll
You all made very good points.
I must admit if the rally is already set in stone in the Havasu area, then the initial question needs to be re-worded. Something like, &quot;after the upcoming rally in Havasu, would you drive 2-4hrs for another rally in the future?&quot; Maybe I'm the only one who sees it that way. <!-- s:thinkin: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smiley_thinkin.gif" alt=":thinkin:" title="thinking" /><!-- s:thinkin: -->

03 DISCO &quot;THE RED OCTOBER&quot;
99 2DR TAHOE-gone but not forgotten

&quot;[b:2lxt838a]BAD GAS MILEAGE GETS YOU TO SOME OF THE GREATEST PLACES ON EARTH[/b:2lxt838a]

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8 years 1 week ago #3207 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Thanks Pierre, some more very pertinent and important points. Even worse of course if you make that 2-4hr drive a 5-7hr drive or worse as it is in some cases.

Mateo, the poll was supposed to be used to decide if Havasu was going to be the location or not. At least that is how I understood it. There was a desire by some to host in Havasu and dissent from others such as myself. We came up with the poll as a way to make a decision one way or the other. My point with this thread is that I do not believe that the poll is asking the question it was supposed to ask.

I have avoided trying to get to deep into the pros and cons of the Havasu location mostly so as not to start a big flame thread of backwards and forwards opinions. We touched on it some in the other Rally Suggestions thread but once the idea of the poll was put forward then I at least decided that the argument was moot and we should just let the membership decide. If they wanted to go to Havasu then so be it, but if they didn't then we would look at alternative locations. Now my concern is that we didn't use the poll for the purpose it was put forward for and that makes it mostly useless (yes I know the other questions are valid but they were not the primary objective).

I have no objection to trying out new trails and new areas. As trail runs. Even as camp outs if needs be. In fact I am one of the authors of the trail list being discussed over on the BAJA list and there are 4 areas of exploration listed to try and find new trails or areas. But not for the rally. The rally is an event that is or should be about more than just the trails. We run trails all year. The rally is (or should be) a 'gathering' or social event as well as a trail run. If you hold it in an distant, out of the way place then you will get less attendees (locals anyway) and I struggle to see how that can be a valid parameter for a rally location.

So a number of members want to visit Havasu? Great so do I. I need to get over then and explore (judge?) the 'authentic British' town and see London Bridge's new home. I am the only member of my 'British' Family that hasn't been. My grandmother has walked over London Bridge both in its original and now its new location and gives me grief that it is 'right next door' but I haven't been. So yes I want to go. 'One of these days'.....

Shaun suggests its only a 2hr or so drive for him? I drive that to run a Tucson day trail or Crown King for example. In fact pretty much ANY trail I want to run is at least an hour or two's drive for me. So why can't you head over one weekend and run some trails and see the area Shaun? Why do we have to move the rally over there to do it? Heck, a bunch of us drove out to Wickenburg one day just to explore and run some new trails. That's about the same for me as Havasu is for you? Doug wants to visit Havasu. He will drive to Hole in the Rock but needs the rally to visit Havasu? I am not trying to be harsh or pick on anybody so I apologize in advance to the 2 people I have listed as they are by no means alone or exclusive in this, but I want to point out some examples off the top of my head as to why I struggle to see why we have to threaten the rally's success and local participation just because a handful of members want to go see a new area?

Plan a trip.

As to the date? No personal experience here of course but my understanding from talking to people who know is that pretty much the whole month of April is boozed up party central in Havasu and not in a good way unless you like being surrounded by drunken out of control college students. My information is that It's not restricted to a week or two as has been suggested.

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3211 by 05LR3AZ
Replied by 05LR3AZ on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Hi all, I wasn't trying to stir anything but wanted to know more in depth as the contributors have provided. Maybe it didn't come through correctly based on how I worded it, my bad. This is all good info and all valid. I didn't create the poll and haven't been too active in any planning of anything recently so figured I'd just ask the questions here. Ian, I directed portions your way 'cause I was looking for your last response type of answer. To me it doesn't matter where we have it so long as there are enough options for trails, we can get a large turnout and the facility hosting the event doesn't charge us a fortune. I've enjoyed driving trails with you all and want to ensure most can attend the Rally.

Why don't we re-do the poll with more open ended questions but also allow member input to the simple, YES/NO... I'll bring it up at tonights council meeting. Sound good?

05' LR3
01' E-350 7.3L 4x4 - Sportsmobile pop-up
94' DI - ROKROVR
[bt]91' RRC SWB[/b]
Shaun - KF7KOY

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8 years 1 week ago #3212 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Nothing is 'stirred' over here Shaun, blood pressure is low, no hyperventilating, all cool and calm. Was wondering if you had the secret nitrous equipped version of the LR3 that none of us knew about though with some of your projected travel times.... <!-- s:thumbup: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_1thumb_up.gif" alt=":thumbup:" title="thumbsup" /><!-- s:thumbup: -->

Seriously though, this is why I didn't want to get into the pros and cons debate as I knew it wouldn't end well using a forum as the medium for discussion. That's why I was so for the poll as it gave us a way to calmly make a decision and follow through with it. Which also explains why I created this thread when I received the poll and it didn't address the question that it was originally conceived for. Or if it did then the person who wrote the question has the super secret nitrous/supercharged/turbo LR product that none of us knew about and wonders why everybody else is so slow?

We can argue the finer points regarding hosting or not hosting the rally in Havasu all day and get nowhere. I suggest we just re-issue the poll without the ambiguous 1st question. It should be quite simple;

Question 1.

Where would you like to see the 2012 AZLRO Rally take place?
Lake Havasu
Phoenix
Tucson
Somewhere else (where?)

Question 2, etc.

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3213 by Dr. Evil
Replied by Dr. Evil on topic 2012 Rally Poll
I used to run a clinic in Parker, near Lake Havasu. Driving back and forth in one day (3 hour trip one way) makes for a long day for anyone working or in this case volunteering. Do we have any members based in Havasu that can help with a rally in that locale?

Joanne Shen-Ortega
2010 LR4 HSE HD, 18&quot; Compomotive/BFGs, Tactical 4x4 sliders &amp; gas tank cover, LR front underbody protection, LR/Warn 9000XP winch, Eezi-Awn 1800 T-Top Roof Top Tent and awning, and ARB fridge/freezer for summer picnics!

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8 years 1 week ago #3217 by douglawyer@gmail.com
Just to clarify, the logistics of having a rally several hours away will be eased by hopefully using &quot;guides&quot; or substitute trail leaders from Lake Havasu 4-wheelers.(who know the local trails) I have been communicating with them and am confident we will get their cooperation. Other than that issue, everything else can be handled via the phone, fax, or email.

I will keep everyone updated when I hear back from them.

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8 years 1 week ago #3221 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
So what we're saying then is that we see no problem with putting the trail selection and leading into the hands of people we have never met and know little if anything about? That they still haven't got back to us even though we contacted them some time ago? That we're going to select a venue we've never seen other than maybe in pictures? That we're all (those who go that is) just going to turn up over there on the day and hope everything is going to be OK?

Why does this not fill me with confidence? Anybody remember the 1st potential camp site for last year's rally and how great it was supposedly going to be? Right up until we visited it for the trail leader training that is and hurriedly changed our minds......

So I understand the council met tonight. Are you guys going to reissue the poll with a less ambiguous question on the venue?

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3229 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
On the 'best dates' question. Its worth taking a look at this web site to get an idea of the general periods that Havasu is 'Spring Break Party City' and when the hordes of revelers will descend:

http://www.azspringbreak.com/packages.html

Looking at that it suggests that both March and April are pretty well taken up.

May not be much of an issue out on the trails other than maybe the odd Jeep full of drunken partiers but it won't be much fun in the evenings wherever you are staying. On the plus side, the mornings should be quiet... <!-- s:biggrin: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_biggrin.gif" alt=":biggrin:" title="biggrin" /><!-- s:biggrin: -->

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3244 by puneetbhalla
Replied by puneetbhalla on topic 2012 Rally Poll
I am a member, but did not receive any mail/PM.

'11 LR4
-KF7PVP

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8 years 1 week ago #3248 by douglawyer@gmail.com
Puneet, I will look into this....sorry.

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8 years 1 week ago #3251 by comater
Replied by comater on topic 2012 Rally Poll

puneetbhalla wrote: I am a member, but did not receive any mail/PM.

Same here.

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8 years 1 week ago #3252 by admin
Replied by admin on topic 2012 Rally Poll

puneetbhalla wrote: I am a member, but did not receive any mail/PM.

comater wrote: Same here.

sent

00 G500
N4GWG

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8 years 1 week ago #3253 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
So what was the outcome of the discussion Shaun was planning to bring up at the council meeting regarding re-issuing the poll with a reworded 1st question that clearly addressed the Havasu vs. another location issue?

Secondly, it's becoming apparent that a number of members did not receive the 1st poll. How can that be if we emailed the entire membership list as was discussed? If we have approx 180 or so members, how many did we actually email?

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3255 by puneetbhalla
Replied by puneetbhalla on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Well, I have no new mail/messages on my AZLRO account and none from AZLRO on my usual webmail.

'11 LR4
-KF7PVP

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8 years 1 week ago #3256 by admin
Replied by admin on topic 2012 Rally Poll

ipgregory wrote: ... it's becoming apparent that a number of members did not receive the 1st poll. How can that be if we emailed the entire membership list as was discussed? If we have approx 180 or so members, how many did we actually email?


AZLRO has roughly 50 paid memberships. Not sure where the 180 number comes from.

All members current in their dues, culled from the membership roster that Rob M. keeps track of, were sent the poll. I missed a few, especially the newest paid members, as they registered after I received Rob's membership roster. 4 poll ballots also bounced due to bad email addresses, and I am in the process of getting those out.

00 G500
N4GWG

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8 years 1 week ago #3257 by admin
Replied by admin on topic 2012 Rally Poll

puneetbhalla wrote: Well, I have no new mail/messages on my AZLRO account and none from AZLRO on my usual webmail.

Check your spam/trash/etc.

The address of the sender in the poll is "This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it." - you may want to add that to your address book.

If you don't have it, PM me and I'll get it to you tonight.

00 G500
N4GWG

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8 years 1 week ago #3258 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Yes I remember it being mentioned that some difficulties were being ironed out with respect to the new member information flow and the member list not being fully up to date because of it, but that was quite a while ago. Didn't we get that sorted?

My memory is terible but I am sure at one point it was mentioned that the membership was up in the 140-180 range or so? No doubt I am mistaken. 50 however seems like a very low number today? Did a bunch not renew this year?

So are we re-issuing the poll then?

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3259 by admin
Replied by admin on topic 2012 Rally Poll

ipgregory wrote: Yes I remember it being mentioned that some difficulties were being ironed out with respect to the new member information flow and the member list not being fully up to date because of it, but that was quite a while ago. Didn't we get that sorted?

I've installed new membership tracking software but don't have it functioning correctly yet. Once it is in place, members will be able to manage their information (email address, mailing address, phone, etc) and get automatically pinged when it's time for their renewal.

It will also be easier to email the entire paid membership at that time.

ipgregory wrote: My memory is terible but I am sure at one point it was mentioned that the membership was up in the 140-180 range or so?

That number is closer to Rob's record of the total number of people who have, at one time, been paid members. I don't believe the membership has ever even neared 100, but I could be wrong.

00 G500
N4GWG

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8 years 1 week ago #3260 by puneetbhalla
Replied by puneetbhalla on topic 2012 Rally Poll

admin wrote:

puneetbhalla wrote: Well, I have no new mail/messages on my AZLRO account and none from AZLRO on my usual webmail.

Check your spam/trash/etc.

The address of the sender in the poll is "This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it." - you may want to add that to your address book.

If you don't have it, PM me and I'll get it to you tonight.



Got it. Sorry, it apparently goes to my google a/c. One that I omitted to check.
Reply sent.

'11 LR4
-KF7PVP

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8 years 1 week ago #3261 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
I am probably getting confused (wouldn't be the 1st time) between paid up members and rally 'members' or web site members. Just thought there was a conversation around the last rally that suggested the paid membership was now much higher than that or had been when we were discussing potential turn out.

Not a dig at the web site or you by the way Bob. My understanding of the issue was that there are a number of ways that people can sign up to be members or have been able to in the past. Paying with Rally payments, paying through the web site, contacting council members directly, paypaling with no other supporting info, contacting Rob direct, etc. There is/was not a comprehensive system in place however to funnel all that info or in some cases even collect it and get it back to Rob to be included in the 'official' member roles. So nobody had an accurate list of all the members. But that was a few months ago now and I presumed it had been rectified so I was surprised that we hadn't been able to contact everybody due to missing information. looks like you have a backup plan in hand as always though so it's no big deal.

So does anybody want to take a stab at the question about re-issuing the poll? This being the Poll thread after all...... <!-- s:poke: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smiley_pokestick.gif" alt=":poke:" title="poke" /><!-- s:poke: -->

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3275 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Was talking to Rob M tonight and asked him what our current paid membership was. Turns out that from Aug, 10 to date we have 80 fully paid up members and at least 1 waiting on payment. Not quite the 180 number I had in my head but also more than the 50 odd that we emailed the 1st poll to.

I have asked the same question 4 times in this thread so far with nobody yet wanting to take a stab at the answer. Since we only emailed just under 2/3 of the membership and the 1st poll did not ask the question concerning hosting in Lake Havasu vs. somewhere else that we discussed issuing the poll for in the 1st place.

Are we planning to reissue the 2012 Rally Location Poll with a reworded clear question regarding the location choices to the full membership?

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 1 week ago #3277 by admin
Replied by admin on topic 2012 Rally Poll

ipgregory wrote: Was talking to Rob M tonight and asked him what our current paid membership was. Turns out that from Aug, 10 to date we have 80 fully paid up members and at least 1 waiting on payment. Not quite the 180 number I had in my head but also more than the 50 odd that we emailed the 1st poll to.

I emailed all members current in their dues according to Rob's membership records he sent me as of April 25th, 2011 - which, at that point, was 49 members (unless I'm reading Rob's spreadsheet incorrectly, which is completely possible) plus the members that have joined via the web site since then. There is no way we have added 30 members since April 25th.

Hopefully Rob and I and some one from the 2011 rally committee can get together at the quarterly meeting to go over the membership roster to get it sorted, which will also help me with the membership software installation.

ipgregory wrote: Are we planning to reissue the 2012 Rally Location Poll with a reworded clear question regarding the location choices to the full membership?


Great topic for the quarterly meeting - have it put on the agenda by posting your request here:
http://www.azlro.org/forum/index.php?f= ... =viewtopic

If you are planning on attending please RSVP on the appropriate event page:
http://www.azlro.org/events-main-menu/d ... ss-meeting

00 G500
N4GWG

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8 years 1 week ago #3278 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Why would you need someone from the 2011 Rally Committee? Either way I am sure Rob can help iron out the discrepancy if he's able to make the meeting.

I won't be attending as I mentioned on the BAJA as I have an existing commitment. The point of the meeting we'll leave for another thread/time but I am confused as to why that is the suddenly the only venue now that we can ask questions? Why then would we have this Topic section on the forum? Why would Doug post up a thread asking for suggestions? Why would we discuss the issue regarding the rally location and agree that a poll would be the best way to settle the discussion, then when the poll didn't ask the question not answer here whether it will be reissued? Why do we have the council corner section? Do I need to ask it in there even though it's a Rally related question?

We had a good discussion going and good points (on both sides) were being made in an open and frank manner, then Shaun mentioned that he would bring up the poll at the council meeting. Since then we have heard nothing more? The minutes have not been posted yet so we don't know what the outcome was. Doug's posted on this thread since I asked the question after the meeting, Rob W and Craig have posted in the forum on other threads a couple of times since I first asked but so far no answer.

I presume time is of the essence for something as major as deciding where to stage the rally? Surely we want as much time as possible to scout and select venues, etc.? Waiting yet another week to resolve this doesn't seem to make sense to me unless there is actually no desire to do so as the decision has already been made and we are just going through the motions?

I choose not to believe that at this point. I choose not to believe that the poll question sent out was intentionally worded so as to be vague and misleading and so as not to run the risk that members would not choose to stage in Havasu as those responsible for issuing the poll want it to be. In other words I am choosing to believe that the council wants to be open and transparent as they have suggested and that the will of the membership is important to them in helping to make such a decision.

It's an easy question to the council that we know was already planned to be brought up at the recent council meeting. Are we now only able expect an answer from them once a quarter at a business meeting? This question as to the location and issuing the poll has been going on now for some time if you count both threads. How much more time do we want to waste?

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 6 days ago #3284 by douglawyer@gmail.com
We have the 2012 Rally discussion slated for the quarterly meeting agenda. If someone can't attend, we previously suggested emailing the council your input/suggestions, prior to the meeting, so we can discuss those as well. I highly doubt any of the council members will have time to review all the comments on this, or other threads, to properly inventory all input/suggestions. Thanks, Doug

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8 years 6 days ago #3285 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
So in other words questions ARE now relegated to the quarterly business meetings then? So we pose a question, it may get answered or it may get taken into consideration and we wait 3 months for the next meeting to get an answer (maybe) is what you are saying?

Or does this only apply to the questions you'd rather not answer? I see plenty of other questions being asked and answered on the forum but not this one for some reason?

Did you get chance to post the council meeting minutes yet Doug?

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 6 days ago #3287 by douglawyer@gmail.com
This is a pretty big topic so we feel it is best handled at the quarterly meeting. We will post complete notes on the discussion. Speaking of notes, council meeting notes will be posted soon....trying to keep my daytime job too.

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8 years 6 days ago #3288 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
No argument about the topic of the 2012 Rally as a whole being quite big but this question was pretty simple and basic wasn't it?

You asked for input on the 2012 Rally.
A question arose as to where it was to be staged and we were told Lake Havasu was being considered.
Some questioned holding it in Havasu.
It was discussed and agreed that the best option would be to poll the members and ask them where they wanted to see the rally held.
A poll was issued that didn't ask that question.
I asked if it was going to be re-issued with the correct question.

I understand that you and the other council members have day jobs and that you are busy, so am I but I don't see that answer taking up too much time to write sometime over the last week I have been asking it.....

We're not talking about discussing where the rally will be held as we already agreed to poll the members for that one. Now if we are talking about going back on that and because the Havasu decision has already been made we are not intending to poll the members to ask the question.. That IS a discussion....

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 6 days ago #3290 by ronrwatkins
Replied by ronrwatkins on topic 2012 Rally Poll
As we have over a week prior to our meeting next weekend, can we please just reissue the poll? Make the location question direct, to the point and call it a day?

I would be happy to set up survey in survey monkey &amp; give the link to Bob to include in the email. It would lessen the impact of having to compile the responses and would also allow us to leave the response time open for as long as possible.

Even with it being a discussion topic at the Qtr Business Meeting, unfortunately the reality is that the large majority of members will probably not be able to attend. Everyone should have an official vote one way or the other and hopefully we can walk away with a decision on our 2012 Rally location at the close of the meeting.

As I said, I am willing to assist in any way to faciliate this process. Let me know. <!-- s:wave: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wave.gif" alt=":wave:" title="wave" /><!-- s:wave: -->

Diana
KF7TXG

Owner of Henry (2011 LR4) &amp; Margot (2013 R-Pod 178) <!-- s:ahhh: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_ahhh.gif" alt=":ahhh:" title="ahhh" /><!-- s:ahhh: -->

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8 years 5 days ago #3319 by admin
Replied by admin on topic 2012 Rally Poll
A new poll has been issued - please make your preferences known via the following url:

http://www.azlro.org/2012-az-lr-rally/2012-rally-poll

The same paid membership (with the corrections noted on this thread) has been notified of the new poll. I am waiting for the most current membership roster from Rob M. and will email the other paid members once I receive that list.

The poll will be active until 3pm on 8/20/2011.

ENTER ONLY ONCE. Duplicate entries will not be counted and will invalidate your vote as a member due to the possibility of different responses and your lack of respect for the people who have to correlate the results.

If you are not a PAID member, please do not participate as you're just creating extra work for the rally committee to have to sift through the responses to exclude the unpaid spam entries.

00 G500
N4GWG

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8 years 4 days ago #3324 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
The new poll is great and covers the location question that we discussed very well. Well done to whoever put it together.

Hopefully we can get enough member responses to get a good feel for the clubs ideas on possible rally locations.

Thanks Guys for re-sending.

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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8 years 4 days ago #3341 by ronrwatkins
Replied by ronrwatkins on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Poll is open for another ~ 32 hours. If you haven't yet - completed the poll and get your opinions included!

<!-- s:cheerleader: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_cheerLeader.gif" alt=":cheerleader:" title="cheerleader" /><!-- s:cheerleader: -->

Diana
KF7TXG

Owner of Henry (2011 LR4) &amp; Margot (2013 R-Pod 178) <!-- s:ahhh: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_ahhh.gif" alt=":ahhh:" title="ahhh" /><!-- s:ahhh: -->

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7 years 11 months ago #3437 by sclarkie
Replied by sclarkie on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Hi guys, I just registered on the forum here. Can't wait for the hot weather to break a bit so I can get out on some of these runs. In reading this (lengthy) thread, I assume whenever the paid membership decides on a location and dates for the 2012 Rally, it will be posted here somewhere? Looks like I just missed a meeting a week or so ago, right here in Casa Grande; can someone let me know how I go about becoming a dues paying member? I looked all over the site, but couldn't find anything. FWIW, I don't care where the rally is held, I'm just anxious to get out and meet some other Rover guys on the trail. See you soon.
Steve

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7 years 11 months ago #3439 by ronrwatkins
Replied by ronrwatkins on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Normally you would go to the Membership section via the top bar navigation. There's been recent updates to the site, so it appears that mostly a link was broken.

I'll alert our webmaster. <!-- s:thumbup: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_1thumb_up.gif" alt=":thumbup:" title="thumbsup" /><!-- s:thumbup: -->

Diana
KF7TXG

Owner of Henry (2011 LR4) &amp; Margot (2013 R-Pod 178) <!-- s:ahhh: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_ahhh.gif" alt=":ahhh:" title="ahhh" /><!-- s:ahhh: -->

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7 years 11 months ago #3492 by douglawyer@gmail.com
First of all, let me say thank you to everyone for your feedback on the polls conducted regarding rally location and other preferences.

Using the information received, and information on other related local events, weather, etc., we are excited to announce the location and dates of the 2012 Arizona Land Rover Rally.

Where: Cottonwood, AZ

When: May 11th-13th

Just a 2 hour drive for Phoenix area members and a 4 hour drive for Tucson area members, this new location will allow our club to explore new and different trails from previous rallies and get to know a new part of the state. In addition, we are hoping that by planning the event the weekend before the Overland Expo, we will attract some of those Land Rover owners to our event.

Look for upcoming announcements on venue, camping, hotels, and more exciting news on Vendor Night and Dinner/Raffle location with a Western show and more!

Thanks again to everyone for their input!

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7 years 11 months ago #3493 by ipgregory
Replied by ipgregory on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Sounds like a great location for accessing a wonderful variety of trails. I am looking forward to it. <!-- s:thumbup: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_1thumb_up.gif" alt=":thumbup:" title="thumbsup" /><!-- s:thumbup: -->

Ian Gregory - N1IPG

Current LR Stable: 97 D90 S/T #1008, 94 D90 S/W #1887 (Project), 98 D1 LSE
Memories of: 84 RRC Vogue 4dr, 93 RRC Vogue SE, 84 Ninety 2.5D S/W, 86 Ninety 2.5TD 2dr, 96 D1 SD.

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7 years 11 months ago #3494 by 05LR3AZ
Replied by 05LR3AZ on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Great news! Glad we could make the venue work with a date that doesn't conflict with OVExpo. I'm looking forward to helping out with the Rally!

05' LR3
01' E-350 7.3L 4x4 - Sportsmobile pop-up
94' DI - ROKROVR
[bt]91' RRC SWB[/b]
Shaun - KF7KOY

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7 years 11 months ago #3495 by puneetbhalla
Replied by puneetbhalla on topic 2012 Rally Poll
Looking forward to it. <!-- s:thumbup: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_1thumb_up.gif" alt=":thumbup:" title="thumbsup" /><!-- s:thumbup: --> Hopefully, it'll be cooler as well given the altitude...
I could help out with preruns etc...

'11 LR4
-KF7PVP

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